The Formula To Pricing Art?

Katie,

What the market will bear.

Basically go to Floyd Snyder's pages and look at his prices. His prices reflect more accurately
what large printing services are getting retail.

If you or anyone else here makes a name for themselves to any extent, they can charge more
....and more importantly....get it.
http://fineartamerica.com/profiles/fasgallerycom.html

Remember at the low end FAA adds $5 to our stated markups. At the high end of larger prints that eventually gets
up to a $50 or $35, I think, additional fee. I think that is at 108 inches. In between it varies as the prints get larger.

Your prices dont have to be to the dollar Floyd's but it is a very fair starting point. There has been plenty of study
done to find those prices, not so much by Floyd as I was saying, but by people he has knowledge of in the larger
industry.

Dave

I just went to the page. I'm confused.
I followed the link to the website. It's alot of dead links and
Sort of cluttered. But it didn't seem like there were actual paintings for sale as much as prints & posters?
I guess I'm just having a hard time with marketing and the formula that I was told was to multiply canvas dimensions then multiply you fee; $2., $3., etc. My issue is also for commissioned work for when I paint portraits - which is very tedious and time consuming.

How much to you want ? There is NO pricing guide - experience and quality (salability) of your work.

there are all kinds of answers you may get - look at others work similar, you can cost it out of the material and the time it takes, reach a price based on the size (square inches).

that is what is really sold on FAA - prints and posters (of real work or digital work). What I would charge for my actual work is only somewhat related to how much I am asking for a (copy) print of that work - so, it's based on what I think someone would or should pay for my work realistically. Certainly and open edition print shouldn't cost as much as an actual painting on canvas or paper - but a photo might get real close.

remember what YOU are asking to be paid on FAA is what your part is - it does not include what FAA charges for printing and shipping - although that gives the buyer the final price for your work.

Also decide if you are a Walmart and think you can make it up in volume or will be selling luxury items like a Neiman Marcus.

Here you are selling prints that have the potential to sell unlimited copies. Unless they are very specific subjects with a limited market.

Katie,

That link is the gallery page. Now click on a gallery, then click on a square image. Not a rectangular one.

All the options are on the right. To make it simple use the prints on the far right. You will see a bunch of
thumbnails. The far right corner one is prints.

All of these formats prints, canvas, metal...etc...have an underlying set of sizes and prices per size.

Prints will keep all of this clear. But all of sizes up and down regardless of material have the same markups
that you enter. The costs for materials vary.

To enter your prices go behind the scenes up under your name and profile tab in the far most upper right hand corner of the screen.

Behind the scenes go to "Default Settings".

First carefully read every setting you can work on. Know what you are working on.

You should be doing this with two tabs running. One on Floyd's FAA. The other on your FAA.

When you are done setting prices close Floyd's FAA tab. Keep only one FAA tab open with the prices, then
hit submit. There was a time recently when having multiple tabs open on some operation was a problem.

Dave

I am not a painter so can't help you with pricing.

But while you are here it is worth bringing other issues to your attention. You need better quality scans or photographs in order to sell prints.

This one at least has major cropping issues and will not print even if it sells.

Hello Katie, I don't know if this helps but I wouldn't dream of charging less than $2000 for an original art piece. Not only would it probably represent at least two weeks of work, but also years honing my skills and of course the materials involved. The important thing is to really believe in the value of what you do and to be able to honestly critique your own work..Ask yourself if you were a customer, how much you would be willing to pay for an original one of your pieces to adorn your wall and go from there! Jane Small

Thank you JC Findley.
I agree with you on that - but honestly, I only started putting my work on here as a makeshift online portfolio (the reason for my bracelet and photos). I honestly haven't taken the time to do that because I have my own prints that I sell on a website. Thank you for your input! :)

Thank you Dave Bridburg! I will need to really sit down and focus on this! The business part is entirely overwhelming for me. I really feel like I need an Art Broker or someone who can manage my work, sales and galleries.

Jane Small, thank you! I am thinking that I have things backwards... so you do not list your actual paintings on here? I've got a lot of work to do, it seems....

Katie,your painting "True Love's Sunrise" ...gorgeous work! Sure it should be $2000 minimum for the original ! Love it! No,I don't advertise originals for sale on FAA. I just love the peace of mind I now have from dealing with this high quality wonderful company that can take care of everything for me with its' excellent print on demand service and world wide reach. A dream come true for me. My paintings usually involve either pastel or beeswax and are quite fragile. I would not wish to involve myself in the anxiety of shipping them long distance. I appreciate very much that you replied to my comment and wish you many future sales. Jane Small

Hello again Katie ! Some good advice might be to listen to Mike Savad. I'm not saying I always agree with him,and it makes me smile in great amusement to think that he is my online guru in many ways ,though dressed like a turkey! It was from reading his forum advice about charging high prices for prints that made me on impulse DOUBLE all my prices once and I found they sold more after that ! Then I put them up again but my sales dropped so I found my happy medium but it was so much more than when I started thanks to him !

turkeys, they are not just for thanksgiving....

ideally though before the prices are raised all the images have to look very good. and all the sizes should be listed. it may scare people to see a high price, only if they click on it, will they see it's for a large print.

the hardest part about being a painter is the presentation of work. it need to look clean and polished. and so many just take a fast snap shot and post it up.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

Katie...many pastel artists price their original paintings at $3.50 per square inch. The more experienced artists price their work higher. Hope that helps. Prints are a different pricing range.

Mike Savad,and anyone else interested, If you ever saw that episode from the British version of "The Office" where David Brent (Ricky Gervais) gets up from his desk having been fired and is attached to an emu ,and the whole thing is so serious and so sad,yet makes you rock with laughter, that reminds me of you Mike being dressed like that! But I must add that your similarity to David Brent as the film character (not the actor of course) ends there since you are a brilliant artist as well as you dispense some excellent advice!

Katie,
I use a $/ sq inch for each medium. It's basically is your time put into an size. I find this easier to calculate (and stay within profitability) and more consistent. I know what I'm going to be charging before I start. It's also much more understandable to clients. Normally I charge a lower rate on commissions because they've done a big part of my time in research, approach, etc. I get releases to sell prints or there is a hefty additional charge. I always publish my prices and rates.

PS This is just on originals, print pricing and derivatives are different methods.
-- mary ellen anderson

" it's personal,'

No it is not. And even if it were you can't let it be. You are in business the instant you put your fist piece of art out there for sale. Business is business. You do not make emotional decisions when running a business.

That is like saying the guy that works on the assembly line should get upset when 75% of the people first look the window sticker on a new Lincoln and say something like "are you out of your mind"?

Do you have any idea how many people make that comment and then drive home in a new Lincoln? That is because the salesman did his job. He did not take it personally, he kept his focus... make the sale...

You have to stay as remote as you can from letting it be personal.

I know, you and others will argue that art is different. No it is not different! No one cares how much of your blood, sweat and tears and your hard work and hours of your life went into the painting. They only know what they like and how much they want to or can afford to spend. That is not personal. That is the reality of selling ANY product.

The links Dave posted above will give you some tips on pricing your artwork. I added a new article that was written years ago by an art dealer that spent years in the business.

Jane Small, Thank you for your kind words and great input!! I agree with the shipping part with fragile pieces. I think when I initially started posting here, it really was just to create an online portfolio, but I hadnt figured out where I would go with it from there. I really feel like it would be best (for me) if I had an art broker or marketer of sorts. I have enjoyed looking at your beautiful art too! I can't imagine charging $2k and not even batting an eye over getting it! Seriously. I haven't reached that type of clientel. :/

Thank you for the advice Mike, Mary, David and Floyd!!
I will begin revamping my photos to look better and who knows, maybe some sales will come about on here. Another reason I didn't take the prints too seriously on here was because I get them here and they would be different priced. So I didn't want to come off flaky or like I was ripping someone off - since I link all my posts here to my Facebook page and website.
Ive still got so much to learn, but I truly just want to paint and not worry about the technical and financial part. That said, I know that it has to be ME handling business, so no time like the present...
Thanks you all, Im going to go check out the links provided for me and make some changes!! Enjoy your Saturday!!!

It really is a balance for art. You want to cover your materials, time, and find some profit. I made up a simple square inch formula - but I prefer to paint large paintings and when I apply that to the square inch I get really high prices. I moved to a more straight forward approach of linear inch. If I sell directly I have one price, if I sell through a commission site I have another. I have to cover the commission or rather the buyer does. You might start with how much you have into a painting, then apply some math to the linear approach and see if that covers you. For example, if you have a 36x48 piece of work, that would be 84 linear inches, multiply that by say $7 and you get a price of $588. Does that cover the commissions and the materials, your time? If not increase the linear price. For me that would be a little low, but I use a 10 - 12 range right now. For smaller pieces I have to be a little more realistic, but I do not do much smaller and when I do it is to generate affordable work in hopes that I gain a collector.

I have been told by many the right price is the one you are a little embarrassed to say. :) Not sure how much truth there is in that, but one thing I do know is state your price with confidence and do not be offended if the buyer rejects. Many times the buyer has a budget and wants something within that budget. I try to work with some people if I can, but I do not give it away either. If they want it, others will that can afford it.

Another approach I take is today the price is as low as it will be. I raise my prices on a regular basis. Not sure how this equates yet as I have only done it once and do not sell more or less because of it. I think if you get a following and you raise a price several times over time is where this strategy will come into play. I use many sites for prints, and originals as well as Facebook, Pintrest, Twitter, and my own web site. I also do shows and festivals when I can. Whatever I can do to get my name, work and card out there.

When your paintings start selling, you will know what your price should be. Be patient, takes some time. I have sold directly for years, this year is my first genuine attempt at selling on line. I like the printing aspect of this. However, the shipping of the original paintings is a whole other learning curve and will affect your price. Plan accordingly. If you need to get some good shipping supplies, I use ULINE.com for almost all of mine. Can be a little expensive up front, but you should be able to ship each piece much cheaper overall than anywhere else I have looked up. I do buy in bulk though. Not that I am selling like hotcakes yet, but when I do sell, I have the materials ready and one painting is usually more than enough to cover it.

Hang in there, and test various levels of pricing. You will find one that works.

Regarding: "The $/inch" Formula, for pricing original art

I can't help myself

So here goes:

..................................and this is our sticky for today. Read well fledglings as this may help you not have to ask your competitors how much you should sell for, which is really silly, if you think about it...........





If you have a favourite thread you think deserves a sticky, let me know in PM, not in this thread. It may not be one of your own.

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I've recently gone to $/sq inch. It has made it so much easier for me to price my work and be consistant with it.
The only problem is small works 9 x12 and under. I have to change my sq inch price (up in price) for those to compensate for the time they take. The small ones take just as long as the bigger ones.

A scenario, I've encountered quite often selling my work :

Customer: Why is "A"more expensive than "B" ? "B" is bigger and more elaborate.

Me: Well then buy "B"

Customer: But I like "A" more

Me: Me too

good one Roger, I am typically 2400. for my 24x30x1.5 as you know Roger since you own one of yourself :) but I get 3200. to as low as 1800. for the same size depending on what I am painting and if they are a famous rich musician which has been the case. But I think more complicated interiors or human portraits VS. simple white tigers,elephants deserves a difference in price on the same size

yes Jani that's so true ,small ones take almost as long

This " Formula" for pricing does not apply to all. Each artist's pricing has more to do with reputation, skill and sales history. A less experience artist might take a long time to compete a painting than a skilled artist but it doesn't mean the buyer has to paid according to the hours spent.

Alfred makes sense.

I found this:

"Q: Is it possible to calculate the value of a work of art by using mathematical formulas? Is it possible to rank artists in order of importance the same way? Can you predict the future of the art market by using math or science or extrapolating from graphs?

A: In spite of the fact that researchers continually claim to have reduced the art business to mathematical formulas, the answer to all of the above questions is a resounding NO. The main problem with attempting to quantify transactions in art is that art is a subjective medium-- it does not operate according to the same fundamental laws of science or mathematics that apply to the rest the universe. Sure, art has physical characteristics like weight, dimensions, material ingredients and so on, but determining a work of art's value or significance either now or at any point in the future does not simply depend on how large it is, what the subject matter is, or how much paint was used to paint it. It's way more complicated than that."

http://www.artbusiness.com/explain.html

Another reason not to speculate in art as an investment. Just buy what you like and be happy.

I don't agree with that theory @Alfred Ng. Time put into the work is your working time. If you punch a time clock, at the end of the week have 40 hours of hard work, would you like your boss to negotiate your paycheck?

True! @edward fielding

I do agree with Alfred. The time thing doesn't really work for pricing art except possibly with commissions. He's totally right about an experienced artist produces better work in less time, plus in the art world reputation counts, whether it should or not is debatable but the fact is it does. I have 25 years experience in my current job, even when adjusted for inflation my current salary is at least double what it was even 20 years ago. Why? Because I do higher quality work in less time than I did back then. If you want to charge by time make sure you are not charging a rate that's the same as an established artist with 30 years of experience. If you are just starting out you deserve minimum wage, just like any job. If you have a few years experience and have developed some reputation you can price accordingly. Keep in mind though, the general public (or even much of the art buying problem) is unlikely to understand why one painting costs more than another painting of the same size, all they see is the size, they don't see the hours, and frankly most of them don't care, and why should a customer pay more for a painting just because you struggled with it?

On the other hand, paintings command more $$ in general than photographs for the very reason the public gives credit to the amount of time it took to create the piece. As well as if its an original vs. a print.

Even within the painting, oil typically commands more than acrylic or pastel or watercolor etc. Regardless of the time spent.

Location and real estate values play a big role in selling quality original art work I have noticed. Must be due to the fact that the most affluent are more sophisticated, better educated and have very substantial incomes which would make it easy for them to purchase $2000.00 painting or sculpture. I have actually lost some sales due to not charging enough since buyers want their associates to know they purchased something of great value.
Printed and framed works like photography must be of the highest quality before anyone will pay for it as well.

Wanted to mention that tying to market in affluent neighborhoods is in general way too expensive in the first place but on the other hand selling in non-affluent areas is mostly a wast of time and a good way to undersell yourself every time.

Thank you. Floyd, I agree even though it hurts a little. LOL. :)

I don't know if cheap sells better than expensive or the other way round. We still haven't worked it out. One thing I know is that luxury items always sell well even during war times.

Now that I am doing some large 25 Foot tall sculptures, I'm inclined to price them by the foot, when I do smaller copper sculptures by the inch or millimeter is the way to go.

I use the $/sq inch method also.

I use a weighted scale base on size, quality and time. I also feel it is better to price higher when a piece is new...people vote with their wallets and when it is still new, nobody has rejected it yet, and artists usually feel best about their most current work, so it should be more. If it sells right away, then maybe it wasn't priced high enough. If it doesn't sell for a while, maybe it is priced too high. If I use such a formula for pricing, it takes some of the guesswork out and my art pricing is more consistent.

ACRYLIC PAINTING PRICING GUIDELINES

First, the final image is evaluated on quality, fitting one of these standards:
1. Masterpiece Quality…One my best works,…very sellable
2. Excellent Quality…Very good design, sellable
3. Medium Quality…Average quality or not very sellable
4. Lowest Quality…Poor design or overall look,…hard to sell

Then the painting is measured in inches. Width” x Height” ÷ 144 = Feet ²

Then using the square feet of the painting, that size is multiplied by this:
1. $200 per square foot for Masterpiece Quality
2. $170 per square foot for Excellent Quality
3. $130 per square foot for Medium Quality
4. $100 per square foot for Lowest Quality

The Time Value is then considered, falling into one of these categories:
1. Factor 1.25x Much time needed to complete painting, or ASAP
2. Factor 1x Usual amount of time
3. Factor .75x Completed in short amount of time

This factor is then multiplied to fit previous size determined price.

Then the price of the frame is considered and added to the total price.

This final price is multiplied by .9 and also 1.1 to give the price range.

Good Day Everyone,

I'm a photographer so perhaps I don't belong in this discussion, but I'm buzz;ed by the fact that several of my images have received over 3000 views and haven't generated one sale. Would someone be kind enough to offer any insight that they can as to what may be "wrong" with these two images?

Thank you in advance for your time and attention.

"I'm getting paid below minimum wage (and was even been stiffed by someone after working a month on their painting!)"

First, you have to decide whether the point is to support yourself, or whether the point is the intangible enjoyment of doing art.

If the point is to support yourself, and you can get paid more doing something else, then do something else. Art isn't either easy or necessarily even a fun way to make a living, if in order to pay your rent you have to churn out endless variations on the same-old same-old painting that you know people will buy. Do the math. How many paintings can you make and sell in one month? If, after you deduct the cost of materials, etc., and taxes, will you have enough money in your pocket to pay for your rent, groceries, car, cell phone, all that? If the answer is no, get a different job that makes more money.

If the point is to get to do art, then it's fine to make art when you feel like it, sell it for what people will pay, and if all you ever earn from your art sales is enough money to pay for your art supplies and a few hundred dollars a year of extra pocket money, then no worries.

Of course doing the math entails knowing how much you can charge for a painting. The only way you find out is by showing your work, putting a price on it, and seeing if it sells at that price.

As far as getting stiffed by people who order commissions... unfortunately that happens a lot. The way a lot of artists protect themselves from that is by insisting on a non-refundable deposit, up front, before you start work on the commission.

Yuri,
There is nothing wrong with your images, your art is beautiful.

Some of your views may be generated by "bots" or robot/computer search engines -- from outside FAA that look at stuff on the web to see if it would be of interest to whoever sent the bot out. No big deal, nothing to worry about as far as I know.

As far as real people looking at your art, if you have ever been to an art museum, you know there is a big difference between just looking at art -- which is fun to do (and free!), and paying money to take it home with you. Lots of people just look. No harm in that, either, it just means that they're not buying art.

I look at a lot of art that I never buy. If I bought every piece of art I ever looked at online or elsewhere and liked, I would need a huge warehouse to store it all.

Let a reputable art appraiser put a price tag on your art. I never buy or sell a piece of art unless it has a certified value and COA. It may cost $200 to $300 for a single appraisal with COA, but it will add substance to your work while offering a base for future pricing.

And don't let anyone tell you that appraisals are based on an artist's hourly rate to create. Art appraisers will only laugh. Price based on canvas size is what the import companies use to price their work. Neither show the value of your work.

Cheryl, great advice.

Did you and Danl and Yuri realize that this conversation started two years ago? Still, seems like an important conversation.

Jane Small...I love your work.



This is sooo beautiful.

Cheryl, I didn't know about Bots. Thank you for the heads up! :-)

If you are primarily interested in selling originals, I would list the original here but look at art sites that are geared to original art like Saatchi, Daily Paintworks, art.com, even Etsy. Look online at individual artists who do commissions. I start at $150 for pets. Make sure all art is photographed and cropped well for display. I have sold a few originals here but after all the site focus is prints.